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GET REWORKED PODCAST: NORMALIZING THE CONVERSATION AROUND EMPLOYEE WELL-BEING

January 23, 2024 Employee Experience
By Siobhan Fagan, Nidhi Madhavan




Normalizing the conversation around employee well-being is one positive outcome
that came out of the pandemic. Businesses now understand the role they have in
supporting employee well-being and the bottom line cost of ignoring this area.



In this episode of Get Reworked, AWS global head of HR Prudence Pitter discusses
what AWS is doing to support employee well-being. 

Listen: Get Reworked Full Episode List

"A leader who can share, 'I had this deliverable that I missed, because I got to
this location, my luggage was not there. It caused a whole ripple effect where I
was not able to be productive for two days. And so this is how I bounce back.'
It's important for leaders to share some of the personal things that they're OK
with sharing that help others recognize that it's normal, not only some of the
ways that professionally they have fallen, if you will, but also importantly,
how they bounce back. What are the ways that they redeem themselves. And I think
that's a very powerful story to tell," said Prudence.



Highlights of the conversation include: 

 * Why you need accountability built into well-being initiatives.
 * Why well-being accounts for the whole person, both in and out of work.
 * How well-being initiatives will not go anywhere if they ignore the ways the
   workplace is impacting well-being.
 * Why leaders need to model the behavior they're promoting.
 * How to normalize the conversation around well-being to remove any lingering
   stigma.

Plus, hosts Siobhan Fagan and Nidhi Madhavan talk with Prudence about
identifying where to focus well-being efforts, why some leaders may need
coaching to have difficult conversations, and if discussing well-being without
following through does more harm than good. Listen in for more.

Have a suggestion, comment or topic for a future episode? Send it
to editors@reworked.co.




TUNE-IN HERE




SHOW NOTES

 * Prudence Pitter on LinkedIn
 * Prudence's blog
 * "Atomic Habits," by James Clear
 * US Surgeon General's Framework for Workplace Mental Health and Well-Being 


EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Note: This transcript has been edited for space and clarity



Nidhi Madhavan: Hello and welcome. My name is Nidhi Madhavan. I'm an editor at
Reworked. Welcome to the Get Reworked Podcast.

Siobhan Fagan: I'm Siobhan Fagan, Editor-in-Chief of Reworked and I am so happy
to kick off 2024 with you.

Today we're going to be starting with a conversation about employee well-being
with Prudence Pitter of AWS. She's going to share some tips for managers to take
home to their workplaces today and take action on, but first let's hear a little
bit more about Prudence.

Nidhi: Prudence is an experienced executive with over two decades of broad human
resource management experience across several industries. She is currently the
Global Head of HR for auto and manufacturing and healthcare and life sciences at
AWS. Both businesses combined operate in over 20 countries.

Previously, she served as an adjunct professor of human resource management and
organizational behavior and leadership for the City University of New York.
She's also an active volunteer in her community.



Siobhan: I can't wait to get going, how about you, Nidhi?

Nidhi: Let's Get Reworked.


SETTING THE STAGE

Siobhan: Welcome to the podcast, Prudence.

Prudence Pitter: Thank you so much, Siobhan. I'm so happy to be here.

Siobhan: Well I am glad to have you here too, to talk about well-being. It's a
great topic for any time of the year, but particularly in January, we all are
full of good intentions, we're all starting fresh. So I really am glad to have
this conversation kick off the year.



To start off, can you just talk a little bit about your role at AWS, and give us
a little bit of a sense of what your day to day looks like?

Prudence: Absolutely. So my role as Global Head of HR, I support to business
lines within AWS. And the groups that I support are global. So they're across
about 22 different countries, multiple time zones in the US, outside of the US,
etc.

I spend a lot of time working with leaders who are advanced in their career, and
also those who are new in their career. So I spend a significant amount of time
talking about people management, having really difficult conversations; talking
about performance management, and quite often talking about overall well-being,
and setting the reminders and setting the stage for leaders to have those
conversations as well.


DIFFICULT CONVERSATIONS AROUND WELL-BEING

Siobhan: Great. So one of those difficult conversations oftentimes is discussing
well-being and I'm hoping that you can just give us a sense of how you started
the conversation about employee well-being at AWS.

Prudence: About two years ago at an off-site in London, one particular group
that I was with, we did a book read, and the book that we read was "Atomic
Habits." And as part of the breakout, I got a little bit creative, and I asked
the leaders to share one personal and one professional habit that they were
really proud of.



And then we took it a step further later in that workshop to peer each other up
with accountability partners, and to commit to a personal and a professional
habit that they would focus on for the next six months, now we've heard that it
takes about 21 days to form a habit. But we also know that with our schedules
and working across the globe, it's just very difficult to commit to 21 days. So
we committed to six months, there were so many success stories that came out of
that. And as you might imagine, if you don't focus on something regularly, it
kind of drops.

So at the end of last year 2023, as we were looking at the year, and we've had a
difficult year as many other organizations have, we were looking ahead as well
as it relates to what is to come in 2024. What can we control? And what are some
of the things that we should be changing? And so we went back to, hey, "Atomic
Habits" was a success for this particular organization. So let's restart that.
So we restarted that conversation that started two years ago where we had
successes but it hadn't continued.

What I'm really proud of with that Siobhan, is the fact that we are now role
modeling that for other leaders throughout the organization. So the leadership
team is starting off we have or personal and our professional habits that we
have committed to. We have our accountability partners, and now we're working to
have those conversations throughout the rest of the organization at every level.

Nidhi: I am curious when you talk about the idea that a lot of this revolves
around conversations.

So in 2022, the US Surgeon General Dr. Vivek Murthy released a framework for
workplace well-being, and it was really about helping to normalize the
conversation. Because, you know, that's essentially what it's about. How have
you normalized discussions around well-being at AWS and more importantly, have
you encountered any resistance?



Prudence: I read that as well. And I engaged in a conversation on LinkedIn
recently, where someone had had mentioned, he'd spends so much time at work. And
so while it's not fully an organization, or a leaders responsibility to ensure
that an employee is whole, it's also not good practice to ignore that, right. So
many organizations are focused on mental health and overall employee well-being.
And so it's important that we normalize the conversation, there is resistance,
usually in the way of can someone else have the conversation versus me.

So there's some leaders who are newer in their career who do not feel equipped
to have the conversation. And so it's a coaching opportunity for me in HR, and
for other senior leaders who have more experience.

I don't see a lot of resistance. As far as thinking that this is not our
responsibility. I do believe that I work in an organization where employees are
very much in tune to the well-being of others, and wanting to do what is right
wanting to be helpful. But there's at times could be, some hesitation, there
could be some instances where the leader does not feel as equipped to have a
conversation. And that's where the coaching comes in.

I am fortunate to be a part of an organization that has a wealth of resources
available to us as employees as it relates to overall well-being. Because we
have so much sometimes it gets overwhelming. And so what I tried to do is ensure
that I am normalizing the conversations in meetings. And I'm asking questions
such as, What have you been doing recently to protect your own well-being? And
what do you need from your direct manager to continue to do so?

And when I get those responses, I remind the leaders that what they need, many
times their employees need the same or something different, but also that their
employees need support from them. So I'm asking them to normalize the
conversation themselves. And in one-on-one and team meetings, continue to ask
similar questions.


DIFFERENT CONVERSATIONS FOR DIFFERENT GENERATIONS?

Nidhi: So it's interesting, you mentioned leaders who might be newer in their
careers versus those who are more experienced, because that actually makes me
think about how generational differences play into this. Do you find that there
is more willingness to participate and lead these discussions within certain
generations? Or is it more nuanced than that? 

Prudence: In this particular role, I haven't seen generational differences as it
relates to the well-being conversation. When I think about the different teams
that I engage with on a daily or a weekly basis, we're talking about a wide
spread of different backgrounds and ages. And I don't necessarily see pushback,
I don't necessarily see hesitation as it relates to generation.

And I think that is because the organization has done a really good job of
normalizing the conversation. We have the mental health affinity group, we spend
a lot of time talking about resilience. And so the organization has made it
normal for us to recognize that one of our taglines recently was, it's okay not
to be okay. And so the organization as a whole all across Amazon had that as
somewhat of a slogan. And because of that, and all of the training and the
resources that came along with that, I find that I am in an easier seat, if you
will, at this point and having the conversations, because employees across
different generations are open to the conversation and recognize the benefits
that come with having an organization that is wholely focusing on employee
well-being.


ACCOUNTABILITY

Siobhan: Prudence, I actually want to return to something that you said in an
earlier response. You mentioned accountability, and people having to be
accountable for sort of maintaining these practices. And I'm wondering what
you're doing. You said that you started this two years ago. You're restarting it
in the new year. So what are you doing to actually build that accountability
into the new practice?

Prudence: So this time around own, it's a matter of a longer process, we had an
end date when, when this was done 2 years ago. And this was also specific to one
leadership team within the organization. Now we have set it for the year with a
check in quarterly, when we have our quarterly offsite, and encouragement for
this leadership team to start to do the same in their teams. So the difference
here is, each individual has one accountability partner with bi-weekly checkins.
And the other part of that is we have quarterly check ins. As a larger group,
when we meet in person for our offsites.

Part of those checkins will be in addition to what's happening with your
accountability partners, what's happening in your team, what's happening in a
particular deal. How are you building resilience? How are you checking in on
employee well-being? And how can we ensure that this becomes a normal part of
how we work always.

Nidhi: That's super important Prudence, this idea of accountability. And
obviously, when it comes to accountability, we usually want to make sure we're
measuring it.

So let's talk about that for a second. Because I think that's something that
keeps a lot of EX and HR leaders up at night, we can do all these great things,
but how do we figure out if they're working? So in your experience, what kind of
methods or approaches do you take to see how employees are doing or track
wellbeing?

Prudence: So for this particular group, and this particular initiative, we
started off with an original check in as far as what are some of the things that
are not working well, and what needs to change. And that's how we got to the
point of recognizing that we needed to do something different. We also recognize
that, hey, we kind of have this in our wheelhouse. We did this previously, we
just need to revisit it.

But what's different this time around as that we have these, let's call them
anonymous checkins that we do, where even though we're together as a group,
whether it's virtually or in person, we have a link to a couple of questions
that we ask. And we pull the information that we get, we visit it as a group,
once we have it together, and then have a conversation about some of the themes.
Usually there are one or two words that bubble to the top and show up really big
in the middle, because there are multiple individuals who have listed those as
areas that are either doing great in their well-being or where they're
struggling, depending on the time of year and the question that we're asking.

So again, going back to two years ago, part of the reason why it didn't last
longer, even though it was very successful, there was not a deliberate checkin
point, there was not a deliberate assessment of how we're doing, it's more of
wow, we have these successes, we have these goals, we hit them, this is great.
This time around, it's a longer period of time, it involves more employees. And
it also involves a lot more checkin along the way to assess whether or not we
need to make changes. And if we need to pause at any time for a different thing
that is better for well-being.


DO CHECKINS MAKE A DIFFERENCE?

Nidhi: So I'm interested, you mentioned this idea of checking in, are there any
stories or instances you can point to where these checkins made a difference?

Prudence: Absolutely, I'll give two examples.

One before my time at AWS, I was in an organization where we started the
meeting, and I only started the meeting with a checkin, I had a smaller team.
And I would check in how everyone was doing. And based on the responses as we
went around the room, I did not have the meeting, I did not go to any of the
agenda items. I spent time on what was needed to make this team whole, what were
some of the blockers to their work to help them be productive that I could
remove, and what were some of the ways in which work was preventing them from
being whole as an individual.

And so I talked about that often with the groups that I support now, because
it's important that we're not getting into a meeting and we're saying hey, how
everyone's doing and everyone is saying, Well, life sucks I'm having a difficult
week I'm having a difficult month, you know I'm having a difficult day. And then
we say up thanks for sharing and then today's agenda item is... that's just not
focusing on employee well-being that's not putting people first.

And so I tell that story as a role model idea for our leaders to think about
pausing when we ask how are you doing? But also asking the question in different
ways because many times you ask, how are you doing and you get fine. And you
kind of move on even before the individual is done saying Fine, but asking
different questions. How are you today? What help do you need? What support do
you need? What's giving you great energy today? Is there anything that could
make your day better? Is there anything that's causing your day to to not be a
good one? What can I help with?

So I encourage leaders to have those conversations now have those checkins in
one-on-ones and in team meetings. And I am very specific about saying having
those conversations in one-on-ones and team meetings, and not choosing one or
the other. Because we have individuals who will not speak up in a group. And we
have others that will. And for those that will speak up in a group, the others
can learn from them and recognize, oh, wow, it's normal for me to talk about my
feelings, and what's not great in this setting. But for those who are not
speaking up in the group, when the manager is having that one on one dialogue
with them, they can take those learnings and action them and or partner with HR,
based on what employees are sharing.

Nidhi: I think what's really important to consider here is when we do open up
these conversations by asking employees, how they're feeling or what's going on
in their world and what they might be struggling with that takes them to a
vulnerable place.

So how is it that leaders can build that psychological safety where employees
can come forward with concerns without fear that they won't be believed or that
they will be judged?

Prudence: I love that question. And it goes back to me having conversations with
leaders about who I am as an individual. And I did that in a way to say, I am
Prudence I, Global Head of HR for these organizations. And I come to the
organization with experience in HR. But I'm also female, I am Jamaican, and I'm
a mother of five I you know, I list all these things, I have a presentation that
I created to walk leaders through different difficult conversations that they
have.

And this was really geared towards performance management. And I started off by
listing personal things about myself, professional things about myself two
separate slides, and sharing how I am as an individual, what are some of the
things that I love, sunsets are one of my favorite things in the whole wide
world. And you know, I showed pictures of me with sunset and my my on my
background on my computer, I have a sunset, I shared about gratitude and the
fact that gratitude is so important to me. And I started end every day with what
I'm grateful for.

And I encourage leaders to share personal things about themselves as they feel
comfortable, as well as professional things. Because we're in an organization
for a certain number of years, we've not, quote unquote, grown up together. And
so there are other things about our teams that we don't know about. We built
psychological safety when we're vulnerable when we're willing to share. And when
our employees can see that we as leaders have more to share, we come with
history, we come with different parts of us that make us whole, and encourage
the employees to do the same. That will help the more difficult conversations
that happen later on.

The other point I'll make is as it relates to psychological safety. It's not a
one-time conversation. It's not a leader going in and say, you know, hi, I'm a
mother of five, and I'm Jamaican, and I love spicy food. And then you know
everything about an individual. It's making time to have small talk, when there
are interactions, and making time to listen as much as we speak and as much as
we share, and leaders remembering what employees share.

So I can't tell you how many times you know, an employee will say, oh, wow, you
remembered that? Well, yes, because I care and I care about you as an
individual. And when leaders start to do that, they will see a shift in what
employees are willing to share with them and how they're able to get through to
employees themselves.


LESSONS LEARNED FROM NOT SHARING

Siobhan: Prudence, you started the conversation off discussing how you started
this well-being journey and the fact that your original initiative did not
actually come through, that the leaders were having great results, but then it
kind of fell off. Did you share this with the broader team?

Prudence: We did not and I think that that was part of the learning and that's
part of the mess. And that is why the shift this year occurred.

So looking back and recognizing one, too much time passed, since we were this
deliberate about having this connection and having this accountability as it
relates to our professional goals, but also our personal goals and building
resilience. But to the other thing that we need to change is we need more
visibility, we need more individuals in the organization, having visibility to
what we're doing, that we're so very proud of, and role modeling for them what
they can do to do the same so that it becomes the norm throughout the
organization. And not only on the leadership team.

Siobhan: I asked the question, because I was thinking about what Nidhi was
discussing in terms of building the trust and showing that vulnerability. And I
think that on a professional basis, it can often be shocking for employees to
see leaders admitting, oh, I tried and this failed, but it's also sort of
empowering because it shows it demonstrates that you too, can experiment and
fail. Do you see any value in that kind of approach?

Prudence: Absolutely. I think there's some employees that, because we're in an
environment where we're so spread out as an organization, we're not all in one
office on one floor running into each other as you're going to the restroom or
parking next to each other and the parking lot. We are in environments where in
some instances, there's a small part of the day where our regular workday
overlap, we have limited time where we are together in person. And so there's
not always clear understanding that one, some of the challenges that you have in
one country is similar or the same to the challenges that another employee has
in another country.

And same with levels and different leadership dynamics within the organization.
There are some employees who might assume that a leader might not have some of
the challenges that they themselves have. So a leader who's willing to share
that I need to be offline today at four because my child is performing in a play
at school, and I can't miss it. And when I'm there, I need to make sure that my
phone is off. I'm sitting in the front row, you know, all smiles so he can see
me, a leader sharing that will help employees who have children recognize that,
oh, wow, this leader is prioritizing their family. And so it's okay for me to do
the same.

On the other side of that to a leader who is sharing that, I had this
deliverable that I missed, because I got to this location, my luggage was not
there. It caused a whole ripple effect where I was not able to be productive for
two days. And so this is how I bounce back. Those conversations are important.
It's important for leaders to share some of the personal things that they're
okay with sharing that help others recognize that it's normal, but some of the
ways that professionally they have fallen, if you will, but also importantly,
how do they bounce back. What are the ways that they redeem themselves, if you
will. And I think that's a very powerful story to tell.


HOW MUCH RESPONSIBILITY DOES AN ORGANIZATION HAVE FOR EMPLOYEES OUTSIDE OF THE
WORKPLACE?

Nidhi: So when we talk about the whole person, there's obviously a huge aspect
of well-being that plays into our work lives because we spend so much time at
work, but there's also a lot of it that's accounted for in someone's personal
life. So what do you see as an organization's responsibility for a person's
well-being outside of the workplace setting?

Prudence: I think the responsibility is a big one. Organizations will say that
they want employees to do good work. We also recognize that for employees to do
good work, they have to be well overall. And the conversation started to shift,
I would say at the start of the COVID-19 pandemic, around how important it is
for an employee to be whole and the role that employers play beyond offering
benefits and employee assistance programs.

So while an employee having benefits that's provided and partially paid for by
the organization is important and it's important for many, if not all employees,
and having an Employee Assistance Program is an added value as well. An
organization that normalizes the conversation, and that helps employees with
proactive well-being measures will go a long way.

So what that could look like is organizations that have different days of the
week or different times in certain days where an employee is encouraged to block
their calendar for personal time, or an organization that has different
challenges that are unrelated to work, their personal challenges with rewards
and leaderboards and sharing information across the organization. What that does
is normalizing us as employees being whole, and the organization taking a stand
outside of providing benefits and employee assistance resources, to help
employees be whole and to proactively take care of their well-being on a regular
basis.

Siobhan: Prudence, I'd like to dig a little deeper into that, because you're
talking about the employee being whole Nidhi said, you know, obviously, we spend
so much time in the workplace. And so I'm wondering how you balance sort of
those benefits that you provide, with actually getting to the root cause of work
stressors and other things that could affect well-being — what part does that
play in your well-being efforts?

Prudence: So it goes back to the conversation and asking the difficult questions
of the employees, what support do you need? And what are some of the ways that
your work is challenging? And I've been asking that question for years in
different organizations. And many times when employees come with, you know, my
priorities are really eating up my time, I'm having a difficult time
prioritizing, and I do a deep dive with the employee and what their priorities
are. So much has shifted. And some of what an employee might be spending a lot
of time on is not necessarily what is moving the organization forward. And so
there's a reset that is needed.

When leaders have the conversations with their employees around, what are some
of the things that they need to ensure that they are doing their best work and
that they're feeling whole, within the organization. Many times it results in a
reset, where employees and leaders have conversations. And employees can change
direction, sometimes it's a matter of taking something off an employee's plate,
or shifting a schedule, there's so many things that could be changed. And
sometimes employees are not privy to that information.

But a leader who's having those open conversations with the employees and
employee who's being transparent and sharing what's most important to them, that
will open up the dialogue for a two way discussion and potential changes as it
relates to how an employee works and how they're able to protect their overall
well-being.

Siobhan: So prudence, you're having these difficult conversations with your
employees and say something happens, where somebody brings up something bigger
than the organization, that the organization can't necessarily help with or
support, is having these conversations sometimes more harmful than not starting
the conversation.

Prudence: I can't think of anything that would be, let's say, bigger than the
organization, I think many of the conversations that we have, even though
they're a difficult conversation, it's still puts a certain amount of
responsibility on the employee to take action.

So while the organization provides resources, and the organization recognizes
ways that we can make changes, many times it's the employee who's taking the
action that's needed.

So there could be conversations that a leader is made privy to, that is related
to, let's say, domestic violence or some other form of violence. Providing
resources to help the employee is what the organization can do. So why that is
something really big and it's very rare that we hear of those instances within
the organization, it's still not necessarily fully the responsibility of the
organization to resolve that.

However, the leader can provide resources to the employee, can partner with
different HR partners or different individuals within the organization to get
additional resources whether it's a leave or a shelter or legal resources, there
are a ton of resources that could be provided to the employee.

Where the leader of the organization comes in is where the follow up takes
place, right. So how are we ensuring that what we have provided to the employee
is working? Now there are things like reduction in force that is beyond all of
us as leaders were The organization as a whole makes decisions that we have to
own. And while an employee might not be a part of a reduction in force, their
feelings towards the fact that the organization needs to do one, the fact that
someone that they were working closely with was affected, a leader can talk the
employee through that. And again, provide them the resources to have
professionals talk them through that as well.

But I think there's a certain level of responsibility when an employee shares
information, even if it goes beyond their work and how they were in being able
to help to be that liaison to get them the help that they need.

Nidhi: As we wrap up, I want to finish where we started. It's 2024, top of the
new year, what's next for well-being in 2024? And what are some of your goals
for AWS.

Prudence: So my goals for the organization that I support currently is to ensure
that the well-being goals that we've set as a leadership team trickles through
the organization, my goal is to ensure that I am staying close to the learnings
that we have when we have all of our checkins, and being very cognizant of any
changes that need to be made, not being afraid to adjust not being afraid to
pivot and to share broadly, not just across the leadership team, but across the
organization as a whole on any areas where we feel that we no longer should be
focused on or an additional area, that should become a larger focus.

So it's a matter of ensuring that the conversation does not drop that it's not a
six or a 12 month conversation. And that leaders are equipped with the tools
that they need and the right language, if you will, to have conversations with
all employees, and more importantly, that they have at their fingertips, the
tools and the resources available to help employees when that help is needed.

Siobhan: Prudence, thank you so much for joining us. If people in our audience
want to learn a little bit more about you or follow you online, where is the
best place they can do so.

Prudence: The best place to do so is on LinkedIn. I also write a blog on p e a r
r m.com. That's peer with two rs.com. I have several blogs there. The best place
to follow me though is on LinkedIn. I have one of those names that's not too
common, so I should be able to be found pretty easily. Thank you so much for
having me. This has been great.

Siobhan: Awesome, we will definitely link to your easy to find LinkedIn profile
to make it even easier. So thank you again.

Prudence: Thank you all so much. Take care.

Siobhan: If you have a suggestion or a topic for a future conversation, I'm all
ears. Please drop me a line at editors@reworked.co. Additionally, if you liked
what you heard, post a review on Apple Podcasts or wherever you may be
listening. Please share Get Reworked with anyone you think might benefit from
these types of conversations. Find us at reworked.co. And finally, follow us at
Get Reworked on Twitter as well. Thank you again for exploring the revolution of
work with me, and I'll see you next time.


ABOUT THE AUTHORS



Siobhan is the editor in chief of Reworked and co-host of the Apex Award-winning
Get Reworked podcast. She was part of the team that launched Reworked in 2020
and was its first managing editor before taking over as editor in chief in 2022.
Connect with Siobhan Fagan:

Nidhi Madhavan is an editor at Reworked, where she leads the contributor
community. Previously, Nidhi was a research editor for Simpler Media Group,
where she created data-driven content and research for SMG and their clients.
Connect with Nidhi Madhavan:


TAGS

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 * hr
 * chro
 * employee well-being
 * employee wellness programs
 * productivity
 * employee experience




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